Seeking info: Duboisia myoporoides for medicinal use

[Naturalista]

I'm a new user on this forum, I sometimes use the product Buscopan which is manufactured and sold for a hefty price by a German pharma out of our local D. myoporoides. I've been looking for info on using the leaves (for GI cramps) as this is a common plant round my neck of the woods - I gather the leaves are the good bit. No luck so far, although I read many of the threads on this forum with great interest.

I just wondered if any particular treatment would be good to minimise any toxicity and standardise scopolamine dosage, and how many leaves to use. There's always the 'chew on one and see what happens' idea, but I expect someone has already done that...

Any advice from all you Duboisia fans out there?

Cheers, Naturalista

[JumpedAngel]

There is a preaty good paper out there by the makers of Buscopan you'll probobly find it if you do a google search, but from memory I dont think they say anything about what active ingrediant they extract or how they extract it etc. I'm not medically qualified so cant give advice, from my experiences with other Duboisias I've found the active principles to be in the ripe drupe so that would possibly limit you even further as with the other Dub. I expect the product might be improved by allowing the drupe to ferment. As for where do you get one, well they are easy to grow from seed and I got mine from the local botanical gardens down here in Melb. try one up your way, you might be surprised what you find.

[Naturalista]

Hey thanks angel.

The active ingredient is butylscopolamine, also called scopolamine butylbromide and hyoscine butylbromide (thought one long name would have done). It's found in the leaves, which the Aborigines used to chew to relieve stomach ache, which is why Boehringer Ingelheim thought it was worth a look at. It's very effective at soothing smooth muscle cramps. The only other reference I found to usage was that Aborigines used to cut a hole in the bark of D. myoporoides, fill it with water, drink it later and get wasted. So clearly both medicinal and recreational use going on there.

Interesting what you say about using the drupe, that's the first I heard of that one. Probably tastes heaps better than the leaves. Corkwood wine anyone? I think the fruit may not be too hard to get, not like hopwoodii with the midnight missions to the desert!

I saw in another thread you mentioned Tim Low's bush medicine book, so will have to see what he thinks about all this. I think leaves are still the go (for my purposes), but just talking and thinking about it has increased my confidence to just try and see. Will let you know of any good recipes I come up with, if anyone's interested.

Plant material: a reliable source (don't you love em) said to go to a nearby beach and 'walk in, you'll find one'. (In to the riparian zone, not the water.)

BTW hopwoodii fans, I have to mention this recent post I wandered into in my travels, a really interesting monograph on the history and culture around pituri. Down near the end there's a description of steaming fresh hopwoodii leaves under hot sand to preserve the nicotine content. I don't know if that's something y'all find interesting or not

http://tribes.tribe.net/tobaccopatch/th ... bb168d1a38

I reckon that'll do now

ps newbie raving on - sorry about that ...

[JumpedAngel]

Errr, I was just thinking I'd have to edit my former post as I believe it is in error, dunno what I was thinking...

You were right about the leaves containing the goodies you're after and these according to Lassak - 'Australian Medicinal plants' contain scopolamine (hyoscine), in cooler climate e.g. Sydney area hyoscymine and norhyoscymine replace scopolamine, the highest scopolamine content is found in plants in the Lismore/Grafton area and curiously in New Guinea nicotine is the main alkaloid in the leaves.

Obviously the 'suck it and see' approach that you mentioned would require a very carfull application.

PS. I'm surprised you haven't spotted it but a .pdf version of the original P L Watson article including the images is available for download free of charge to members (which you obviously are) a bit further down the page in this Australian Medicinal and Psychoactive plants section.

[Naturalista]

That is fascinating JA. I wonder if the different alkaloid contents are due to subspecies or direct effect of the temperature on the plant chemistry. Anyhow the local plant 'has the dope' I'm after, so yay. I did read somewhere that the alkaloid content varies widely, so yes, careful suck and see, and only if no other option. One leaf, two leaf, three leaf..

Found the Watson link, looks like y'all know all about that. I thought pituri was just about nicotine, oh, so no.

PS, was the sugarwood mannitol any good?

Subversion is quick..

[JumpedAngel]

The sugarwood is one of the many things still on the list for this coming seasons prospecting sessions.

I only ever get up there in the warmer months.

according to Lassak chemo-types as well as tenfold fluctuations in active constituents can vary between one plant and another situated right next to it, our Aboriginal cousins no doubt had the skills for determining which particular plant they required and here we are trying to classify their stone tools while all that disappears in front of our eyes.

[Naturalista]

hopefully chemotypes correspond with phenotypes.



Tracked down a Bundjalung guy I know, hope you don't mind if I quote you H. To his memory the leaves are not prepared in any way, he knows some good Indigenous herbalists, further advice may be forthcoming.

Thanks JA.

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[roughbarked]

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